Speak Honest Podcast: Real Talk on Relationships, Attachment Styles & the Work of Healing Childhood Trauma

91. Authentic Expression Over Perfection | My conversation with Ellie Laliberté

• Jennifer Noble, ACC | Certified Relationship, Dating, NLP, & IAT Coach

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What if the only thing standing between you and your most authentic work is the pressure to sound perfect?

In this heartfelt conversation with award-winning author and book coach Ellie Laliberté, we dive into what it really means to create from your truth. We talk about witness consciousness, dropping self-doubt, and letting your writing (or your healing) be messy, human, and alive. Ellie shares how to quiet perfectionism, return to inner peace, and write (or live) for the version of yourself who needed it most.

You might want to listen if:
 • You feel paralyzed by perfectionism or fear of judgment
 • You’ve lost your creative spark trying to “get it right”
 • You’re craving more honesty and play in your self-expression
 • You struggle to let go of control and trust the process
 • You’re ready to remember that good enough is already enough


About Our Guest: 

Ellie is a Canadian Award Wining Author, a book coach and self-awareness coach. She is passionate about all things spiritual, higher consciousness and she teaches Witness Consciousness Practices. Simple, easy going and always up for a deep - intelligent conversation. She always aims for authenticity and enjoys being playful in a world where too many take their lives way too seriously. She's a mix of calm-grounded and bubbly energy.  

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DISCLAIMER: Speak Honest podcast content is informational, not professional or medical advice. Jenn is an ICF relationship coach, not a licensed therapist. Consult health professionals for specific concerns. Client opinions do not reflect Speak Honest’s stance. We aim for accuracy but are not liable for errors or outcomes from ...

SPEAKER_01:

Hello, and welcome to Speak Honest. I am your host and certified relationship coach, Jennifer Noble. It has been my passion for over a decade to help women like you heal. What's been holding you back from having the relationship you deserve? Are you struggling with a relationship where you can't seem to voice your emotions, needs, and boundaries without having it blow up in your face? Then you have found the right podcast, my friend. Get ready for practical tips, empowering truths, and honest conversations. Now, let's dive in. Hello everyone, and welcome back to another episode of Speak Honest. I am Jen Noble, your go-to relationship coach. And on today's episode, I am so excited to be joined by a woman that I consider a friend, a colleague. The only reason that Dance of Attachment is actually getting out into the wild and my book coach. But so much more importantly, Ellie, she is a Canadian award-winning author. She is a book coach. She is my book coach. She is a self-awareness coach as well. Ellie is passionate about spirituality, higher consciousness, and she teaches witness consciousness practices to help women return to inner peace. You can see why she's such a beautiful guest to have on Speak Honest, because this is all that we talk about. She's also the author of Letters from U2U, which is this beautiful book that she has, and she is the creator of the course A Journey Back to Inner Peace. What I love about Ellie is how she brings this mix of calm, grounded wisdom with also her playful spirit and her ability to connect with others. It just really reminds us not to take life too seriously while still going deep into the things that really matter. And so if you are interested today in anything that Ellie and I are talking about, then go ahead and check out danceofattachment.com. That's where you can check out all the information about the book that we're going to be talking about today, as well as ways that you can get in contact with myself or even Ellie. So as we are getting started today, Ellie, go ahead, jump in, say hi, tell us a little bit more about yourself.

SPEAKER_00:

Hello, hello. I'm so happy to be on your podcast, Jen. This is such an honor. I love your personality. I love who you are, and I really love this podcast and the theme that goes with it. So wow, I am, I have a hard time describing myself because I'm not identified with so many things in my life, and I do so many of like different things that it's kind of like I never know what to say so much about me and like who I am in the moment right now. But yeah, I guess I'm a very simple woman that has been through a lot of shit, a lot of emotional trauma in my life, and that shaped me basically to just come back to like simplicity and really just have fun with life and get away from like the drama, and we're gonna be really honest here, but the bullshit of the world and all of the distractions. And so, yeah, I guess I am a very authentic person and I love to have really authentic conversations such as this. So I'm really excited for this conversation with you.

SPEAKER_01:

What I love most about you, Ellie, when I first got to meet you was your authenticity. Because when I started working with Lucky Book Publishing to produce Dance of Attachment, one of the things that they said that I was going to get was a book coach. And I was like, oh great, this is somebody that's actually going to be able to help me hone in on what it is that I need to do. And then I was trying to write the book, and I think I just like ghosted everyone in Lucky Book Publishing for quite a while because I didn't know what I was doing, or like I thought I'd gotten in over my head. So can you speak to me a little bit about that as a book coach? Do you see that often? And how do you help people through that?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, of course. I mean, everybody is so different in the way that they write as well. A lot of people say, like, oh, I'm not a writer, and then it's not true. Like everybody can write something. When you have imagination, which we all have, when you have skills from your business or from just your life experience in general, you always have a story within you that you can write. And yeah, I see a lot of self-doubt, unfortunately, in many of the authors because they just don't know exactly how to, you know, speak their truth. What I like to tell everybody is like, you have to be as much as you as possible inside of your book because this is who you are. And I think that when we were, you know, just going through your things that you wanted to put inside of the book, you weren't sure exactly if you should be that blunt in your book. And I was like, yes, like this is who you are, and I love that person, you know, and I want to see that in your book as well. So I just have a sense of like when I meet someone and I see their personality and I see their authenticity, I want to see that as well in their book. I feel like once people know, and I know it sounds kind of like simple, but as soon as someone knows, like, oh, I can just really be me and myself, and then it feels like that it starts to flow for them. Because, you know, writing a book, yes, it's personal, and yes, you know, you're talking about sensitive subjects sometimes about your own story, but it's supposed to be really a beautiful experience to self-expression. You're supposed to be writing the book for yourself before you write it for someone else. And so if you're having really like a lot of fun while you're writing and you're just it's an art, right? It's to me that's how I see it. My writing has always been it's an art. So when I write, I want to be nothing more than myself. I'm not trying to impress anybody. I'm just trying, not even trying, I'm just wanting to really just express the fullness of who I am inside of my book. So, you know, whether that's a nonfiction or a fiction with your imagination, you have to really just be in a state of like, like, don't force your writing. Because if you're forcing your writing and you're not in your inspiration, it won't flow anyways, and then you're gonna self-doubt. That's where your self-doubt comes from. So this is kind of, yeah, that's what I see. I see a lot of authors wanting to rush the process as well. And I tend to tell them, like, this is not something that you want to rush, because if it doesn't come from your heart, it's gonna show in your book. And so that means it's gonna show that you forced it, that you just wanted to write something to write something.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, just to get it out there and have it in. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. You said something that was really powerful, and you said, write the book for yourself first. And I think that that is really impactful because I something I had written, I think, in like my author's note in the beginning of the book was I wrote this book because it's what I needed five years ago when I was struggling and in depression and drinking myself to sleep and all of that kind of stuff. You know what I mean? And so that really hit home when you said that, because that's exactly why I wrote this book. I wrote it for myself and then tweaked it to talk to the women that I'm writing to, you know, to talk to the ladies in my program or my clients or to the women that find me on Instagram or whatever, and they're like, oh my gosh, finally somebody gets it. Like that's the part that's been getting to me so much later, lately. And and you're so right. You said that to me. It was I so I I was writing the book, you know. I've always had this idea of how to write the book and how I wanted to write the book. And then I finally gave it, I think, my manuscript, some of it to you. And I was so nervous in that moment, right? And I was just like, no one had actually read my book yet at this point. Like, no one had read my words at this point in time. And your initial reaction is what ends up shaping to me the rest of this book for the rest of the time, because you didn't say, like, Jen, this is so unprofessional. You can't write this. Like you, that's what I was totally expecting. I thought you were gonna be like, Jen, this is this is not, this isn't what we do. Instead, the very first meeting, you were like, I haven't stopped laughing is what you said. Yes. I was like, oh, it's funny. Okay. That's kind of what I was going for. Like, I'm just blunt and playful. And right, that's why my my company is called Speak Honest. It's kind of my brand. And so, even down to the subtitle, the only reason the subtitle, I thought, overthought that subtitle twice. I was like, no, it has to be way more professional. We have to do something else. And you're like, but Jen, that subtitle's so you. Exactly. That's the help that you really bring to people. So talk me through a little bit of that. Like, what was it like even for you when you started reading it for the first time?

SPEAKER_00:

Well, first of all, the reason why I was saying like I couldn't stop laughing was because I was relating so much to so many things that you were talking about in an attachment style that I know that I had, right? And so when you put something so much like in the obvious, and I think that I had talked to you about this, but you're just taking out the seriousness of it. It doesn't mean that it's not intelligent and it's not important for people to understand these concepts. But what I really loved about your book is the is the fact that what I I love reading, that's why I loved reading it so much. And I be honest with you, I don't read as fast usually because I'm not that I'm not interested in the books, but sometimes it just doesn't relate to me all that much. And so just may sometimes it's just the way that it's written. But for you, I was like, oh my god, I love this so much, and I want to see the next part because I could see all of my patterns that I used to have, and that made me so dysfunctional in relationships, and you just brought this kind of like twist to it where people are. I don't understand how someone could be reading your book and feel like shit, like at all. I seriously feel like everybody that's gonna pick up this book is going to be like, oh my god, like this is what I used to do, or this is what I still do. Like, what the hell am I doing? And they're going to be laughing at themselves. And this is exactly what I feel is powerful about your entire book, is that you just brought this lightness to it because attachment styles, and I think you really, really nailed it down with the research and everything on how this is not just you making up shit. Like it's really legit, and this is really it's all the truth. So it's not like it's just someone who's talking about these things and saying, like, oh well, when you're in a relationship with this guy, well, this is how you feel. That means you're like that. And then that means no, you're really, really deep into your research, and you know, you're an expert in all of this, and it shows, but you're not boring the shit out of us. That's what I want to say. We're having fun when we're reading your book, and we want to know more. Like, I remember reading, you know, the beginning, and I was like, oh my god, I'm so excited to know who I am. Like, what pattern because I had an idea and I'm like, but is this really who I am? Like, is it really my attachment style? I'm very curious. And then you were like explaining all of the attachment style, and I remember looking at it, I'm like, oh my god, I think I'm that. And then I would read the other thing, and I'm like, oh no, I think I did that too. And at one point I'm like, shit, I don't know what I'm what I am. I was laughing at myself because I'm like, I think I did a couple of like the different kinds of obviously really, I think that in my patterns, I I can say that I was very much sorry, I meant I'm missing the uh not the avoidant, the other one. Anxious? The anxious, yes, I think I was like that. Or disorganized, which is a little bit of both. But yeah, the the anxious. I think I was really anxious. And then when, funny enough, when I came into a relationship where it had been a while that I had not been in a relationship with someone, it was almost like the the opposite, where I was now the avoidant, and my partner who was loving and kind and like treated me like a queen. Yes, treated me like a queen. He was the one who was anxious, and I was like, oh my god, I know that I was like you before, and I don't want you to be like that because I, anyways, it was just so funny what I could see. It's awesome.

SPEAKER_01:

No, it's so true though. I have my own experience like that, but the opposite. In my marriage, I was very avoidant, very like pushed him away because he was very anxiously attached. And then when I started dating again, I started dating someone who was avoidant, which is the cause of like, you know, all of my upheaval of life. And I learned in that moment, I was like, well, I'm acting like so out of the norm for me. But it's that learning of, oh, there's a disorganized attachment style in there somewhere of like oftentimes people with disorganized attachment will lean in the direction that is opposite of their partner. And so if you have like a fully anxiously attached, let's just say woman in this example, then it really it doesn't matter. Anyone she's kind of in a relationship with, she's gonna be, you know, pretty anxious, like in terms of, and not anxious like like our bodies are anxious, like just to be clear. In fact, I wish there was a different word for it, because it doesn't feel the same. It's an attachment, like an anxious attachment, not an anxiety, just for everyone to be clear. What's cool about that is like, oh, okay, this is how she's going to be. So even if some other man is anxiously attached, you know, then she's gonna be like clinging to that, except she won't be attracted to him. It's really how this works and the science explains all that and whatnot. But that's what's really cool about that. So thank you for sharing that because you basically are having the experience that I want readers to experience as they're reading through it. And I worked really hard. Something that's important to me is storytelling as a speaker, right? So as like a professional speaker, that's the first thing we learn to do. Tell a story. People don't want to just be talked at for 30 minutes when you get up on do your keynote. And so that's something that has been wired in me for so long is how to tell a story. And I wanted to start most of my chapters with those stories and do all of that and pulled in client stories and pulled in my own stories. And I'm really hoping that that's the part that people are hearing and seeing. So talk me through that a little bit too when you're reading the book or anyone else's book. How impactful are stories?

SPEAKER_00:

I think that stories are very important because, again, everybody can relate to what someone has been through. So you can give a lot of information about something that you know, but if you don't have an example or analogies and just really things that are real to share, people are not gonna listen because people want to feel something. And I think that it's really obvious that you can't just write something that has no feeling in it. So AI has been very popular right now, and I know, I know that people want to go the short way and they want to use AI to write their books now. But the thing with AI, and maybe it will advance to you know a little bit more consciousness and feeling-like, but at the moment I don't believe that it's there. And what happens is that it's really, really noticeable when it doesn't come from a human heart, because we're missing all of these subtleties of these feelings inside of someone's writing. I mean, writing to me is way more energetical than anything else. And so if it's written by a robot, there's no energy inside of that book. This is how I feel. And so I do believe that that storytelling is even more crucial now that people do that, now that AI is out there, because AI is not gonna, you know. Anyways, maybe, but I don't believe that AI can really justify a story from someone who's been through something with all of their emotion, all of their pain, all of the intensity inside of that story. So I do believe that it's always very, very important that anyone that's writing a book, whether you have a super serious business, and you know, like your business can be seen as very, very professional, but just the fact that you can put a little bit of your own story inside of your book that's related to your business and to the practices that you teach or things like that, is going to just bring your business even more alive, I believe. People want to see authenticity again. They really do. And so authenticity will be seen in stories way more than just in information.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, I love that you brought this up because I was thinking about this recently in terms of how like Chat GPT or AI or any of them has actually benefited me, but not in the way that a lot of people expect it to. So I've my whole life, I just I can't write. I know, I know you would tell me, yes, you can, Jen, but like I just feel like I can't write. I mean, I do have dyslexia, I have ADHD. Words on paper don't flow well for me, right? And so speaking, fine, no problem. I could do that. So I started finding new ways. In fact, I learned this through my son, through his like special accommodations he has at school because he has ADHD and autism and all of those fun things as well. Shocker, he's my son. So I just gave it all to him. Here you go, son. And so as where he's getting help, I'm learning from his teachers that say, hey, just you know, voice it into your phone or into your computer, your laptop, let Google Docs take it and then tweak it from there. So I started taking all of these little skills and all these ideas. And I had a teacher. So right, I'm I'm in college, back for psychology right now. And I had a teacher who told me this something, which was all of my writings, all of my papers and everything are very refreshing to him. And I had never heard that before. And I was like, oh, like explain that to me. And he goes, so many times now, all these kids, everyone is using AI, Google, anything to all sound the same because they think they're supposed to sound polished, but you don't sound polished. And my stomach, I remember it dropped because I was like, oh no, I don't sound polished. Like, I don't sound good. And he was like, and this is where I learned that this concept of AI, I think, is gonna revolutionize those of us that don't talk like other people, don't write like other people. Do you know what I mean? So now people are gonna pick up my book. I'm in the perfect time frame for this. People are gonna pick up my book and not read a woman who can't freaking figure out a run-on sentence to save her life, and instead see that run-on sentence with authenticity and not AI. And that that's why I want to encourage people out there that are afraid to do things like this. I was definitely afraid. I had no idea I could ever do anything like this. And yet be yourself in that. Like be imperfect, have weird sections in your book and you know, go off the rails a little bit. The amount of times I had to like rein my editor back in because she would be like, This should be different and this should be different. And I was like, stop changing my voice. Yeah. And I got that confidence through you because that's something that you teach a lot to women, which is to be in your authentic expression. And so I want to ask you a question. When you're coaching writers, how do you help them to move past the self-doubt that they have in themselves and into their authentic expression?

SPEAKER_00:

Again, it's different for everybody because everybody has a different style, like a different personality and a different way of dealing with their kinds of things. And you know, sometimes even I have authors that don't really talk about it, and then they only talk about it almost after or really, really close to like being published. Everything has been done, and now they they have that block and it's not even in their writing, it's in their publishing. I would say that I'm very good at just bringing back someone to be grounded and to again take out the seriousness of something. I guess I can say that when an author to me is being very serious and being very like in self-doubt, what I like to remind them is that they have to feel their writing from their heart. And again, it can't come from their mind. I know that we're using the mind to write, obviously. But all of their worry, all of their self-doubt, that's all in the in the head. That's all self-image. And so I help them kind of like drop their self-image and drop the way that they want to impress so much. And I tell them, like, what is true in your heart? What is it that you're doing with this? Are you having fun with this book? Why are you putting it out there? And that's why we have even a section in the book that we're doing with authors where we say my dream, because we want the author to reflect on their dream of why they're writing the book. They're doing it for the reader in a way, but they're actually really doing it for themselves at the beginning. So that they really know like where is this book coming from? If they realize that the book is coming from their heart, they will not be rushed, they will not feel rushed, they they won't be so caught on a deadline, and they will go with the flow with their book. And so I think that, like I said, it's different for every author because everybody's so different. But as soon as I start to see a little bit of anxiety from my authors, I try to be as calm as possible and just bring them into this calmness and be like, this is simple, this is not not a big deal. I mean, your book is is going to be a big deal in the sense, but at the same time, it's supposed to be fun, it's supposed to be something that you put out into the world for yourself first, like we were talking about, and not give yourself so much pressure as to be perfect, because there's no such thing as perfection, and we all know that, right? The less that you're actually really perfect inside of your book, the more that your book is gonna be authentic and real. So I remind everybody to again to just write when they're inspired and never write from an energy of doubt, because that's not gonna flow well, right? So if they're feeling kind of like insecure, whatever, and in a moment, I tell them to like, okay, well, then don't write right now. Take a break. Take a break, take a break of a couple of days, and then come back to it when you're feeling inspired. Because if not, it's not gonna be real and it's not gonna come from your heart.

SPEAKER_01:

That's actually really powerful because so many times we feel like we have to push through, right? We have to keep going, there's no stopping. Go, go, go. But like I know in my process, I think I signed on with you guys in February, and I didn't even like I had been working on the manuscript and the concept, but I don't think I really, really started working on it until I was gonna do it in April, and then I couldn't. It was like I just had so many mental blocks, stuff was going on in life, and I was like, I can't, I can't, and I just shut down again. But it's almost like you encouraged that and you were like, that's okay. Just reach out when when you're ready, when it's time, when you have the time. And I knew in the summer, I didn't have school, I knew I could get it done at that point in time. So I started doing it a little bit more, and then you and I started working together a bit more, and I was like, okay, let me get this done. And then the second part happened the editing took a month, which was so much more than I expected, like putting all the little pieces in place. I I always explain it like building a house. If anyone's ever built a house, they have to pick out the tiniest details they never expected, like the color of the doorknobs, and all of a sudden every shade of brass is starting to look the same to you. And it's like, hey, you know, what type of lines do you want on your book covers and your chapters? And it's like, I don't know anymore. Like you say, just take a step back. That's what I did. Sometimes I would just take breaks and it's gonna come out when it comes out. I love, I love, love, love what you said. You said your book is gonna be a big deal, right? You're a big deal. But this right here, this moment is not a big deal.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

This moment right here is just another chance to tell your story and and speak from your heart. So I love that. But you were talking about not taking yourself so seriously, doing all that stuff. So I wanted to ask real quick before and as we're wrapping up, if you were giving someone out there advice, some sort of playful practice that they could integrate into their life to help them when things are starting to feel too heavy. Can you offer some advice for that?

SPEAKER_00:

Are you speaking about book wise or just in general than like Oh, that's a good question.

SPEAKER_01:

I was thinking people who are writing, but you know what? Let's go in general because I know lots of women are writing, and I I know that you help other women in your life as well in what you do. And so just in general, when you are working with people, because you're a self-awareness coach as well. What is something when we're starting to feel like life is getting too heavy? What's a playful practice we could do?

SPEAKER_00:

Well, I would say, and that goes with witness consciousness, obviously, because it's just so powerful and it is so simple, and people sometimes don't understand what it is. But for me, when I understood what this consciousness was, it just really blew my mind as how simple life can truly be when you know how to just step out of your ego self and out of your serious self and look at a movie. So I like to see my life as a movie. I am just this character that is playing a role in a movie. So when there's something that's becoming too serious or just bringing me some anxiety, I remember that my life is just a movie and I'm a character, and this is a play, and nothing is going so seriously, nothing serious is going on in my life, really. So I can kind of like step back and I can see the drama, I can see the chaos, and I can know that all of that is not me because I'm just a character, I'm playing a role, but it's not me. My truest self is still, it is peace, it is grounded, and it is really just very simple, and I don't get bothered by things that are like the smallest things of life, because I don't feel like that should come and disrupt my inner peace. I want to stick to that. So I'm always remembering like if something happens, whether it's with finances, whether it's with a relationship, I step out and I say, whatever, I'm just gonna let this play out because this is just a movie and it's not permanent, it is temporary like everything else. Everything is so temporary, and so I kind of bring that lightness to all of the things that are happening. And so even if it's in your writing, again, your writing can be super beautiful, but it's not serious. It's just your self-expression and it's light, and it's it's supposed to be playful, and it's supposed to be making you feel really good when you're releasing that energy outside of yourself when you're writing, right? It's not supposed to bring you any kind of anxiety. So I think that in the process of things sometimes, and I will say as well, because I've seen this a couple of times, but even in the process of bringing this book out to the world and the process of publishing and everything, where there is some kind of like little details like you were talking about, of like, yeah, we have to look at the little grammar errors and things like that inside of the book. At the end of the day, whatever happens with your book when it's out, the most important thing that you have to understand when you're writing a book is that you are sharing who you are with the world. And you shouldn't put so much attention on the little little details that because there's never never anything perfect. We try to make things perfect. That's our ego. We try to make to control everything, and that's what happens a lot of the time in everything in our lives. But if I'm talking about a process of publishing and all of that, and where there's a lot of technicalities, which you're you're part of right now, like we have to understand that we have to let go of a control at one point and surrender to what is and to know that it's good enough. Because what? We are good enough. I love that. And a lot of the times it's because we feel like we might not, we have this insecurity that we are not good enough. So we're projecting out into whatever piece that we're creating, whether it's a book, it's art, music, this is what happens. So we have to just step back again.

SPEAKER_01:

We are good enough. Oh, that's so beautiful, Ellie. Thank you so much. And I I love that the observation, the movie, the understanding that we are enough and that we don't have to get bogged down and the perfectionism. It's brilliant. No. If you are listening right now and you are incredibly inspired by Ellie's words, as I often am, then I want to encourage you guys to go out and get a copy of her book, which is Letters from You to You. If you want to cry when you fall asleep at night, make sure you grab this. But it's they're really stunning. They're all little letters and they're all so beautiful. And it's just this like way. I almost it was like for me, it was like healing parts of my inner child and things like that as I was reading this, because there was, it's like as it says, letters from you to you. So if you want to go check out this amazing book by Ellie, I highly recommend it. I'll stick the link in the show notes. I will also put a link for how you can contact Ellie if you feel like you've been wanting to work on yourself in these ways and Ellie is really resonating with you, then I highly recommend getting a chance to work with her. And as she has, is her course, which is called A Journey Back to Inner Peace. Stunning.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. I think it's a woman's journey back to inner peace. Sorry, I haven't gotten through it. So beautiful.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, like I'm the worst at remembering the names of anything. This is even a woman's journey back to inner peace. If you're somebody that's been feeling out of alignment with yourself lately, you know, there's always, of course, the relationship reboot program. You can come and join us in the Speak Honor Ship. But all of my ladies always know that I encourage that they go get multiple sources of resources for themselves to go get that help because we want to be able to learn in all these different environments. So thank you so much again, Ellie, for coming on. And for anyone that is listening, if you are on Amazon and you are picking up letters from U to U, also go ahead and pick up Dance of Attachment, which is my new book coming out. And it will be out by the time this podcast launches. I know, I can't wait. Why smart women do dumb shit in relationships? Like Ellie said, you don't have to feel dumb, right? And you don't have to feel like there's all this shit going on. But if you do do dumb shit in relationships, you're not alone. And I tell many of my stories in this book about the dumb shit I did all the time. Especially, I think that doesn't come until the second part, but wait till you read about the spreadsheet I used to keep about tracking my ex's stories. All the things we do for love. But go check it out. You can get it on Amazon. You can also go to danceofattachment.com. You can go check it out there. I will also be in LA on November 15th for my in-person book launch that will also be hosted by Lucky Book Publishing and also have other authors there that you guys can meet. So if you've been thinking about wanting to write a book and you live in the LA area or up here in the Bay with me and you want to drive down, I would love to see you. Or if you just want to come support me, you know I will always come and see you guys there. So, with all of that said, Ellie, thank you so much for coming on today, and I will speak with you next time. Take care. As we wrap up today's conversation, always remember that healing is a journey, not a destination. And it is an honor to be a part of your healing journey. If you want to dig deeper into the topics we cover today, be sure to head over to our show notes where you can find all of the valuable information mentioned in today's episode right there. And please remember to rate, review, and subscribe if you enjoyed today's podcast. Your feedback means the world to us and helps others discover our podcast. Until next time, remember to speak up and speak honest.

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Jennifer Noble

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